Game Update 67: Darkness Dawns — Arena of the Gods
Game Update 67: Darkness Dawns, expected to launch just hours before SOE Live 2013 officially begins, will introduce an indoor “Arena of the Gods” featuring instanced versions of the nine Avatars which have been roaming Norrath since Avatars returned as contested content. These avatars will be of the same difficulty as the open world equivalents, but provide rewards of a reduced quality. Presumably you’ll only be able to defeat one avatar per trip, although it would certainly be amusing if you could do all of them on one visit.
Tags: game update 67
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Comments (33)
Tron Baby
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I thought in their announcements that they said you could fight all the gods, and respawn them again but only get a reward from each every 3 days??
I wonder what they mean by reduced rewards?
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Lempo Of Everfrost
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They mean you are not going to get an equivalent reward for killing the avatars in a scenario that is not in any way equal to the contested version.
The gear is supposed to be and should be considerably less.
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permafrost inq
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Why launch it when all/most of the devs/SOE staff will be at SOE live?
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Daalilama
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“Considerably” less depends on what the definition is….if same difficulty as in contested but in an instanced version the gear reward should be lower but the question is how much lower….same old risk vs. reward…make the gear too good and high ends will flip (which has already happened without even seeing what the loot it)…make it too crappy and the rest of the raiding community will go off the deep end….soe is incredibly bad at gear balance.
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Lempo Of Everfrost
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The instanced versions of the avatars were put in to pacify the entitlement crowd, they were demanding access to the content, now they will have access to the content. They are being give a leg up to be able to learn the strats for the fights, without having to put forth the same effort that others did to learn them.
There is a big difference between a scenario where if you botch the pull you stand to lose the mob to another group waiting and hunting avatars using ‘baited feeders’.
After learning the strats for the mobs if they want avatar gear then they can go out into the open world and kill them, the only thing that is preventing them from doing so at that point is the complete unwillingness to do so.
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Zijan
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Lempo you sound just like an Elitist. As for the Pacify remark SOE had said several months after the original avatars disappeared back in TSOish they were going to put the avatars in instances to make them available to all. So here’s a fix to the issue, Remove contested avatars and do what you said you were going to do years ago. Problem solved except for the Entitlement crown that loves to pray on locking them down.
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Dadley
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And you sound like a lazy dude who just wants to /claim his stuff he doesnt deserve in the first place.
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Feldon
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Zijan is right.
Almost 2 years ago, I heard the same thing — Avatars would come back, but they would be instanced. They disappeared I think because some on the team were against Contested altogether. What we have now is a compromise.
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Silzin
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To be the largest problem with having Contested Avatars is that, without the gear from them the normal Raid Progression is made much steeper. The guilds that can lock the Avatars down will be able to gear there raid in the gear that makes all of the HM stuff trivial and the guilds without it are going to have a very hard time on that same “Trivial HM content”. This is all because of the Adds being the DPS check and adding 10-20% more dps checks the kill time by 50-75%.
You know the phenomenon that Slippery has been talking about for …. Years?
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Chemsin
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avatars aren’t supposed to be the starting point for raid progression. You don’t need the loot off of them to progress. if you look at the difference between avatar loot and alternative items from instances, the different is not enough to yield ” 10-20% more dps”. It certainly doesnt make the current SG HM content ” trivial “
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Chronusxx
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The current 6 avatars are easier than any challenge mode mob in CoE except maybe Oligar or Baelon/Barrodas. If they let anything better than the stuff on those mob’s loot tables drop then it’d be ridiculous. The loot from them should be a joke to match the difficulty of the mobs.
The only reason the loot for contested is so good in the first place is to try and encourage competition between guilds because it’s worth it for all guilds to attempt to contest them, problem is only one guild per server is willing to call list or even log in a few hours before others raid.
The greatest thing is only 2 guilds on Splitpaw have killed avatars and the 2nd one has only done it by camping during their own raid times and then 1 pulling them with strats gotten from videos. No other guild even bothers camping them, if that’s the same across the board for those who want access to the content I think they need to man up and actually try first.
Overall though I’d be fine with them being removed from game entirely and having the loot from them put on the later SG mobs with the rare drops only on the HM SG mobs, that’s the level the gear is at, but the mobs are just 2 groupable push overs.
Also, you say elitist like it’s an insult.
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Jazzalyn
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Definitely have to agree with Zijan here.
Back in EQ1 – people who played MMO’s had time to spawn camp rare mobs for weeks. Now one-two guilds a server at most are made up of 24 people who have the time to spawn camp like this.
The difference in time commitment is already obvious in progression. Guilds made up of members who have more time to play or can log in at the drop of a hat already progress much further and faster and get most of the first kills, which is fine.
I think having mobs on top of that that no one else can get because they dont have 24 people whose jobs, work, family, or school allows them to log in at exactly the spawn time of the mob is a little unfair.
I think it’s pretty elitist to think its “Entitlement” just because you and your guildmates lifestyle allow for flexible timing. As long as the gear is balanced where the instance version is less than the contested, I don’t think you have anything to whine about. and I think its a great balancing act of SOE to play to not its “entitled” players, but to the sheer general masses whose lifestyle don’t allow for this playstyle.
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ARDUR
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I just hope the arena isnt a knockoff of champions respite. So tired of that zone lol.
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Lemilla
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Launching a GU when the devs are too busy to fix the bugs that always come with a GU? Great.
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Froak
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there is quite a difference between guilds fighting over contested mobs learning the strats, and 1 or 2 guilds that can 1 pull all of them. if any other guild is trying to learn the mob, gets lucky enough to form up and get 1 pull ahead of the farm guilds and fails they are SOL.
to me it makes sense to do it this way for the older avatars, but i definitely dont think they should have the 2 new ones they will be adding in there. at least not for a while.
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Chronusxx
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3 new ones*
And to be honest if the only reason to have them in the arena is for people to learn strats because they can’t do it from the numerous videos or watching the mobs in game then it makes perfect sense to have the 3 new ones in there.
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Hoot
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I was hoping for a new model for the avatar of Drinal that;s not based entirely off Drinal’s model. However I’m pleased to see a unique model for Prexus and an entirely new Solusek Ro model.
And for the welfare recipient’s out there complaining of the avatars becoming part of an instance. Well SoE already stated the gear they drop isn’t going to be on the same level as the contested version’s. Problem with contested content is that it’s basing itself off an old and obsolete gameplay mechanic model. This isn’t EQ1, never has been. EQ1 contested raid mobs were not fun for anyone except the ones who bullied their way to the top through various means. Two years ago when that EQ1 progression server came up, the amount of agonizing drama created by this issue was so idiotic that GM’s had to step in constantly to resolve an issue after report after report after report. Reminded me the “good ole days”. Hell even some of the original devs like Brad were aware that the mechanics needed to be overhauled to work properly as contested content with Vanguard.
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Silzin
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any word when this is going to be going to Beta? as it is know if it goes to Beta Today then they have less than 4 weeks.
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Striinger
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Anyone who doesn’t believe there is a growing (prevailing) entitlement culture is playing and living life with blinders on… and fingers in their ears. SOE has made it clear that’s the group they are targeting with their “play your way” mantra.
It just happens that “I wanna be elite like that awesome warlock (without icky hours of practice, research or playtime. )” is the way a LOT of people want to play. It pisses off/on the warlock, but that’s only one player upset with an army of happy fauxlite players remaining (with loaded SC accounts).
I hear people whining about real life conflicts and feel your pai7n, but when we’re MMO’s EVER dominated by the gainfully employed (and social…rl social)?
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Striinger
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@Hoot
Contested hunters are now on welfare? I almost cried when I read that you feel bullied too. You’re such an entitled victim! My heart goes out to you; want a hug?
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Amaitae
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Fighting them all at once..(or at least a combination of two/three), that would be a challenge! Dropping bastardized unique mythic-ethereal loot having unique player-created art !
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Tabri
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I wish I could have what the female avatars are wearing on my female toons sigh
Im in a hardcore raid guild and we don’t even feel like running around overland zones to chase avatars, we probably could kill them Im sure but whatever. Everyone basically logs in at a certain time does the instances zones, kills the hardmode stuff and logs out when raid is over. Everyone works and is on a schedule we are lucky if everyone even shows up nowadays its summer. I think this would be fun its just new content for us to mess around with now when we have the time do so so on our hours instead of Sony’s, lesser stat loot or not.
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Stark
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The current avatars are crazy easy, they were added/updated with the start of CoE so most guilds at the time could kill them and havn’t been made harder yet. The ONE thing preventing pick up raids from onepulling all of them is that not EVERYONE in that raid knows the exact strat, letting them train on the current difficaulty of avatars is just stupid tbh.
Make avatars HARD, like endgame mob hard, and I can (maybe) agree with a arena for them if it’s at most 1 mob every 3 days.
Also, the whole “I want all the gear of hardcore players but not to put in any of the time they do” attitude is just annoying. If you have the time and energy to actually practice and collect gear you get the gear. If you don’t you don’t.
Maybe you want it all but if you can have it all without any real time spent of challenge then whats the point?
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Hoot
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@Striinger
When I say “bullied”, I mean trying to involve real life threats into a video game or threating to report other guilds with false accusations so they get complete rights over the raid mob. Ever remember those contested dramas?
You and a couple others use that term “entitled” a lot. I’m aware its a good buzzword to hold onto when backed into a corner, but it doesn’t serve much purpose especially since you can’t argue on why contested raid mobs is still a good idea today. Remember, this is a videogame, we’re here to have fun. Now to some, it’s not a videogame, but their only worthy accomplishment in life, but to many others, it’s a hobby that we do on our off time.
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Lempo Of Everfrost
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@Hoot
Real life threats huh? You are such a tool.
The term entitlement absolutely applies here, you just don’t like hearing it, possibly because deep down you are disgusted with yourself as you should be for having that mentality.
The true buzz word being tossed around here is ‘elitist’, that is the term the entitlement crowd hurls at those that have things they want, yet they don’t want to do what they did to get them, instead they want the rules twisted, bent, modified etc.
There is a good argument as to why contested mobs are good to have today, some people want that content, some people want crafting content, some people want face roll easy zero challenge solo zones that drop mythicals, some people (for whatever reason) want SOEmote. There is an absolute assload more of every type of content in the game in relation to contested content, and that contested content overlaps with some others.
So unless you can come up with a better argument as to why contested content is a bad idea than the fact that it makes a certain segment of the population cry foul because they feel entitled to the gear but are unwilling to do that content your claim holds no water.
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Clay
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Hoot’s definitely right there. There’s more to life than EverQuest – a lot more – it’s just some people don’t see that, oddly enough.
In regards to people being unwilling to do the content for the gear, that is simply not true for many guilds. We may see an avatar spawn on Freeport for example, but by the time we all log in and get the raid going the avatar is already being pulled and slain by the top raid guild. It isn’t like they wait around watching for the avatars to spawn either, being able to calculate approximate spawn times after they killed the same avatar before. It isn’t a matter of putting spawn camping time into the equation that should make them the ones that “put more effort in, so they should get the kills over everyone else.”
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Hoot
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I never used the term “elitist” though. Got the wrong address.
And really I care less if you call me “entitled”, it’s a video game, you think a random accusation for a video game is going to hurt my feelings?
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Chemsin
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@ Clay
The avatars spawn within 3 day windows. theres no approximite timing. people in Black Flag do sit there and watch the avatar spawns just like every other server and it often takes us multiple pulls.
Killing avatars is a competition. you have to do what it takes to win. that means creating a call list, having members check / watch the avatars regularly and having a guild of people that respond quickly to that call list. If people are unwilling to do that, thats not the other guilds fault. you need to be better. Its very possible in fact Reign Storm killed Tunare just the other day.
That being said with 9 total avatars and “practice instances” there will be much more competition for them which imo will make it more interesting. 1 guild on any server will struggle to keep all 9 of them down. however you will still have to figure out the timers, watch the spawns and beat the other guild to them.
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Claizuc
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It’s this attitude towards contested competition that entirely justifies the term “farming.” It’s just like waiting for your crops to grow, then harvesting them as soon as they’re ripe. This isn’t something fun and rewarding, to sit and watch this. The reason we are unwilling to sit and wait is because we aren’t foolish enough to waste our time doing it when there are other, more enjoyable aspects of life to look to.
If you are interested in competition, the answer is not to raise the in-game standards of everyone else to meet your ridiculously unnecessary ones, but to lower your own. The whole point of games is casual entertainment. There is nothing entertaining about sitting, so we don’t do it. If you disagree, by all means continue doing what you do. We just simply seek a greater window of opportunity to even attempt these bosses in their natural spawn points.
Good night.
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Chemsin
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You don’t have to sit there and stare at the spawn points 24/7. just log an alt at the spawn and check them periodically.
Part of your argument is valid and thats the whole reason they are adding the instanced avatars and like I said I think its a good thing at this point.
“If you are interested in competition, the answer is not to raise the in-game standards of everyone else to meet your ridiculously unnecessary ones, but to lower your own”
^
Thats like arguing that basketball hoops should be lowered so everyone can dunk.
There is nothing wrong with being a casual player, my problem is with all the people arguing that contested raid bosses should be removed from the game entirely.
My fear is that the game will get to the point where everyone is in instances and the only interaction you have with other players outside your guild is in global chat.
I sure hope the game never gets like that…..
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Chemsin
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@ Hoot
if you don’t like competing for the contested mobs then don’t do it. Many raid guilds enjoy that competition and consider it one of the most fun and rewarding aspects of the game. thats why they were brought back. You have plenty of other content to enjoy if you don’t want to participate in the competition but please don’t ruin it for the rest of us.
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Feldon
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Some of the comments above make me weep for the future.
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Chemsin
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Care to elaborate?
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